Maximum speed with Black powder.

[Boerrancher]

[/QUOTE]

Those diminishing velocities made me think it would take a whole lot more powder to get one to 3,000 fps, more than would have time to burn in the barrel.[/QUOTE]

A professor of applied physics could probably take that document that I linked to, and a given bore size and projectile weight and be able to make a pretty close calculation. I barely passed Applied Physics 101, so I am not your guy for that answer.

[Boerrancher]

Think of the striking energy of a 2000lb plus bullet hitting a target. Black is not to be taken lightly and given the current politics and worst worsening situations, we may at some point be back to making our own black because the smokeless is not available anymore either by regulation or scarcity. just random thoughts and an old man, james

James, you have made a very valid point. Earlier this week Aliant just announced they were canceling all powder orders for the foreseeable future. They were not even going to fill the orders in the system due to a shortage of nitrocellulose. It is expected that other power manufacturers will follow suit. For the past year I have all but stopped shooting anything that uses smokeless powder, and have gone to all flintlock rifles. I have also been buying 2-4 lbs of the Holy Black a month. The only BP guns I own that use caps are my revolvers, and I am sitting on about 2000 caps for them, and replace them as I use them.

With all of that being said, in early 2020, I was asked by the State Militia Commander to start a Militia Company in my area, which I have done with reasonable success, as Missouri actually has a legislatively created state militia to serve as a reserve component to the Missouri National Guard. Taking my previous military experience to heart as a student of military history, one of the things I recommend to people for their preparation if they were hunters was a small bore 32 or 36 cal flintlock rifle or an English Fowler of the 20 ga variety if they had bad eyes, and to learn to use them well and stock pile lead in balls and shot. We know from history that hard economic times drives large game to the brink of extinction, so just like my grandparents in the Great Depression, small game will be what is available, so there is no need to waste powder and lead in anything larger than a 36 cal. Plus with a 36 cal 60 grs of 3F and 2 patched balls inside of 40 yds will quickly dispatch a deer or an elk, with a well placed shot.

The point being, I can hunt with a blackpowder rifle and at the same time have an AR strapped on my back for self defense, and not have to expend ammunition I might not be able to replace, if the powers that be have their way. I also know from history, that the Mujahadine in Afghanistan, started initially defeating the Soviets, with a few Lee Enfield SMLE rifles and a lot of Muzzleloaders. We think of them with their AK 47s and RPG 7’s but that was not until they had captured Soviet Supply lines, and acquired the AKs and RPGs, because the Communist government that had deposed the King, had confiscated anything that was not black powder.

[indian joe]

[QUOTE=Boerrancher;5727667]

The chart on page 28 shows the Maximum pressure generated by the density of the powder, in a closed system. Earlier charts show pressure based upon density of compaction, etc. Please go back and reread all of my previous comments about pressure. All of them start or end with the words, “unless you do something stupid.” The “something stupid” is leave an air gap or plug the bore in a manner that creates a closed system, and then yes it will turn into a pipe bomb, because 20,000+ psi is a tremendous amount of pressure. If you take your favorite rifle and double or triple charge it and seat a ball on top of it like you normally would the only things that will happen is it will kick like hell because of the additional payload of unburnt powder + Ball, you will have a huge fire ball and a bunch of unburnt powder all over the ground.

top of page 27 under the heading from page 26
IX STRUCTURAL STRENGTH OF BLACKPOWDER
"Intrinsic strength ------ Several 1cm cylinders (of blackpowder) with diameter of 1.3cm, each having different density -- slowly compressed until they shattered and that pressure given as a function of density in figure seven "
figure seven is the graph you quote on page 28
its the crush pressure of powder cylinders formed from powder of different density
this graph is not about pressure generated from combustion at all

so we back to the point of contention about maximum pressure

I agree with you about overloads under a single projectile --- law of diminishing returns - blowing excess powder out on the ground - 2000fps is about the limit unless we go to small calibres and really long barrels -- the firearm becomes unwieldy and impractical before we get to the absolute limit (whatever that is)

But close the system and tell me that blackpowder is incapable of generating pressure in excess of 36000psi ? I dont believe that until I see concrete test numbers that prove it and there is nothing in that 28 pages that does so......................................

[Sandro_ventania]

I do speaking it too