7.62x54r Primers?

[jiminmo]

So I went to Grafs reloading yesterday and picked up some reloading stuff. anyway I said I was new to reloading and asked the guy behind the counter what size primer to buy for the mosin nagant round. He said small rifle primers, so that's what I got. After doing a bit of reading it looks like a lot of the guys use large rifle primers. So do you think these small ones will work? I have S & B brass that I'm using. I will be loading for plinking using the recommendations from C.E. Harris for the "100 yard target/small game" load if it makes any difference.

Thanks for the help.

James

[Dutchman]

The brass will take only large rifle primers. Small primers won't fit. The dude at the store just sold you the wrong item.

Dutch

[jiminmo]

OK thanks that's what I needed to know.

[WILCO]

So I went to Grafs reloading yesterday and picked up some reloading stuff. anyway I said I was new to reloading and asked the guy behind the counter what size primer to buy for the mosin nagant round. He said small rifle primers, so that's what I got. After doing a bit of reading it looks like a lot of the guys use large rifle primers. So do you think these small ones will work? I have S & B brass that I'm using. I will be loading for plinking using the recommendations from C.E. Harris for the "100 yard target/small game" load if it makes any difference.

Thanks for the help.

James

Sounds like you are putting the cart before the horse James. I wouldn't go any further until you have a solid grasp of what you're doing and with what components you're doing it with.

Pick up a copy of LEE's "Modern Reloading 2nd Edition" Reloading Manual:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/484...loading-manual

And then get a copy of the Lyman "Cast Bullet Handbook: 4th Edition" Book :

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/867...h-edition-book

There's no excuse for getting the wrong components. Take a break and go back to square one.

[Hardcast416taylor]

For goodness sake STOP! Get some learning behind you before attempting to start loading ANY cartridge. As Wilco has said get these books and READ them, especially the parts about primers and powders. Next, ask questions here on the site if there is nobody around you that loads or casts to talk with.Robert

[jiminmo]

Hey Guys thanks for the advice. I know I'm very new to reloading. What I was doing is buying the powder and primers while I was waiting on my press and books to ship. You're right I should have known which primer to get going in there but oh well.

As far as casting boolits I've being doing that for a while, so I’m not quite as naive on that subject.

Thanks again!

James

[madsenshooter]

You should have known, but I think the clerk who helped you should have known too. Warning: Don't let them sell you any of the Russian unleaded primers! Junk, won't hardly fire a .308 sized case full of 4895, unless it's the Russian variety.

[WILCO]

You're right I should have known which primer to get going in there but oh well.

The above statement tells me all there is to know about the attitude and intent of the reloader in question. Best wishes and good luck in the future.

[1Shirt]

Find an experianced reloader in your area and see if he will be willing to mentor you!
1Shirt!

[ukrifleman]

Re-loading stuff?
What powder did you buy and what made you choose that particular powder. What charge are you thinking of using with what bullet weight and diameter? Are you planning to load FMJ or cast bullets?
If you can't answer these questions with any degree of certainty then don't attempt to load ammunition before you gain some knowledge.
I strongly advise you to take note of the previous replies; get hold of a good reloading manual such as Richard Lee's Modern Reloading Second edition and read it BEFORE you do any loading.
Or even better, as has been mentioned, also find someone who is an experienced reloader and get him to mentor you.
You owe it to yourself (and the poor unfortunate s.o.b. who might be standing next to you on the firing point) to produce safe loads.
Reloading is not difficult, but it is a precise undertaking, you are measuring powder in very precise amounts matched against bullet weights that are also precise. NEAR ENOUGH IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH.
Get it wrong and you can produce something that is at best no good or at worst lethal, to you and others.
ukrifleman.

[jiminmo]

I have books coming in the mail. I am one of those people who likes to have all my equipment ready so that when I do gain the needed knowledge I am ready. With that said I have read some articles around here and I want to load my mosin nagant with a cast bullet for plinking. AFTER reading the manual and research I was planning on loading according to the data presented by C.E. Harris in his CAST BULLET LOADS FOR MILITARY RIFLES article.

I bought the lee 312-155-2R mold and I bought bullseye powder and I mistakenly bought small rifle primers ( won't do that again).

I say all this to convey that I wasn't trying to produce loads with no reference point. I’m sorry if I came across that way.

James

[HillbillyJim]

That really suprises me that any clerk at Grafs would be that dumb. I have shopped in their various stores for 20 years and have been impressed with their staff.

[I'll Make Mine]

The Graf's clerk may have misunderstood (given the OP was buying Bullseye -- which seems a little fast for a 165 grain boolit, I might add) and though he was feeding a 7.62x38R Nagant revolver, rather than the 7.62x54R Mosin Nagant rifle. Small pistol would be correct primers for the Nagant revolver rounds. Alternately, might have heard it as 7.62x39, and small rifle is common for that round...

[Blammer]

yea , me thinks the clerk was thinking pistol too.

Most times when people are talking about the rifle they say "mosin" which refers to the rifle, "nagant'' in short speak refers to the pistol.

Well now that you are going to reload, the small pistol primers will eventually come in handy. They don't eat much and they won't go bad.

[I'll Make Mine]

Yep, small pistol primers are worth having around. They're correct for .38/.357, 9 mm, all the smaller semi-auto pistols and revolvers, and some .45 ACP -- reload for more than one or two cartridges, and you'll surely use them. The OP, however, has small rifle; same thing applies, they keep well and don't require much maintenance, but they're a little less commonly used than small pistol; the commonest reloaded rifle cartridges (.303, .308, .30-06, .30-30, and their offspring) use large rifle. Think .223/5.56 and offspring, .22 Hornet/K-Hornet, .30 Carbine, and similar rounds, on up to 7.62x39 (Boxer primed) to use up those small rifle primers -- does this fall under the "must acquire a rifle" rule like molds and dies, or does he get to slide on something as insignificant as a box of primers?

[ukrifleman]

I have books coming in the mail. I am one of those people who likes to have all my equipment ready so that when I do gain the needed knowledge I am ready. With that said I have read some articles around here and I want to load my mosin nagant with a cast bullet for plinking. AFTER reading the manual and research I was planning on loading according to the data presented by C.E. Harris in his CAST BULLET LOADS FOR MILITARY RIFLES article.

I bought the lee 312-155-2R mold and I bought bullseye powder and I mistakenly bought small rifle primers ( won't do that again).

I say all this to convey that I wasn't trying to produce loads with no reference point. I’m sorry if I came across that way.

James

Hi James,
I am sorry if I seem to be raining on your parade yet again but, I have to ask why you opted for Bullseye powder for 7.62x54R. This is a very fast powder, not ideally suited for large capacity rifle cases. Did the guy at Grafs recommend it?
There several causes for concern, high pressure is one, small amounts of very fast powder in a 7.62 case could possibly detonate, creating dangerously high pressures. There is also the risk of double charging a case when small amounts of powder are used, which again, could lead to a catastrophic failure of the action.
It is a safer option to use a powder that will at least half fill the case, so that if you do mistakingly double charge, the powder would overflow thus making you aware.
The Lee 155gn bullet should be fine, I would recommend a powder such as Accurate 5744 with this bullet; I have used it with good results. There are other powder options that would be suitable such 2400 or even Unique, I am sure other experienced reloaders will chip in with their favourite recipes.
Enjoy your reloading experience, but above all do it safely.
ukrifleman.

[opos]

Hi, James. Been reading the posts with a great deal of thought....want to share a bit of information with you...I've been a "loader" since the late 50's or early 60's...loaded a ton of rifle ammo in those days...mostly 30-06 and 270 as well as a couple of "wildcat loads" .... all pretty simple and straightforward stuff....then I quit loading for a long time...I've been back loading for about 8 years now and until recently just straight case handgun cartridges...38/357/44 special and mag/45 Colt. Had to go through a complete new learning curve and when I began again I simply started at square one with current manuals and asked a buddy for help.

Most recently I've gotten a 30 cal m1 Ruger Blackhawk and in doing some reading I realize that it's a different creature than the straight case rim headspace handgun cartridges I've been loading and again...since it's different and "new" to me...I'm back at square one and taking things one step at a time.

Finally I bought a couple of the el cheapo Mosin's and now am faced with the high pressure, rimmed rifle cartridge...again, I'm back with my buddy and reading the books. I would no more try and go buy components without a really strong understanding of what I'm dealing with than fly to the moon. I watched a man way many years ago screw up badly on a 30-06 Ackley improved and it almost killed him....blew a modified 03-A3 into scrap metal and much of it got him.

Please don't take exception to folks that want to help...these guys are often experienced loaders that have made the mistakes or have learned slow and easy by watching and listening.

I've found that "gathering" all the parts early in the process, though tempting, where reloading is concerned can lead to serious mistakes. I'd hate to think of the results with a high pressure cartridge like that rimmed Russian because of any kind of a hurry...Sure we all want 30 years of experience but it takes 30 years to have 30 years. Slow and easy get's the job done safely and keeps you safe.

[jiminmo]

Hey Ukrifleman

Your right I think it is a fast burning powder too. However the article I read by C.E. Harris says

"For gas-check bullets loaded without the gas- checks, for cases like the .303 British, 7.62 NATO, 7.62x54R Russian and 30-06, I use 6-7 grains of almost any fast burning powder. These include, but are not limited to Bullseye, WW231, SR-7625, Green Dot, Red Dot or 700-X. I have also had fine results with 8 to 9 grains of medium rate burning pistol or shotgun powders, such as Unique, PB, Herco, or SR-4756 in any case of .303 British or larger. "

I also plan on reloading .380 and if I understand correctly bullseye is a good powder for that calliper. I was just trying to kill to birds with one stone. This will be for a plinking load that allows me to use my mosin nagant at very little cost while letting me consolidate my powder needs. Do you have any experience with this load? Does anyone know how it performs?

Thanks

James

[Junior1942]

James, in no way, shape, form or fashion should a newbie be using Bullseye in a big ol' 54R Russian case. C.E. Harris knew what he was doing. You don't, not yet. I'd bet the odds are better than even that you'll double charge a case and possibly create an explosion near your face.

[ukrifleman]

James,
I am afraid I can't help you with .380 loads as I have never used that calibre.
IMHO , If you want a powder to load relatively low velocity cast pistol AND rifle loads, I personally would have opted for Unique, as it is slower than bullseye and should be a bit more rifle friendly.
I still have concerns about pressure spikes in .30cal rifle cases when using small amounts of very fast pistol powder, whatever the book says!
Plus the chance of double charging a case when using small amounts of powder.
Call it caution gained over 40+ years of reloading.
ukrifleman.