Need Load for Steyr M-95 8x56R

I have 3 M-95s with cracked stocks on order from Century. I have read that generally the cracked stocks are often easily repairable. I do expect to get at least 1 shooter, which brings me to my question. I am ordering brass from Grafs and will be using Lees 205 gr mould for the 8x56R. Would 10-12 grains of Unique be a good safe starting point? Or what other loads would you suggest. I am also going to need a few of the mannlicher type "clips". Would any one know a good place to get some?
Thanks Mike

What are you sizing boolits to for that?

You'll have to hunt the gun auction sites and ebay for the clips, or buy surplus ammo to get them. I suggest you try the Lee boolit as cast, no sizing, and hand or tumble lube them. The GC you can usually snap on or push on enough to work. Try 13.0 Red Dot or 16.0 2400 to start.

I say use an unsized boolit because the Lee boolit need's to be .332+ and mine throws about .330. You migt gain a little by Beagling. What ever you do don't size them any smaller or you'll find out what frustration can really be.

Try old western scrounger for the clips.
The price has gone up a whole bunch but I think they still have them.
A year ago when they were plentitful I paid $2.50 each for them now I think they are about $10.00

Century cracked stock rifles can be anything from very minor cosmetic problems to major wood missing. Fortunately, it's much more common to have the minor issues than major ones.

Even the ones with chunks of wood missing I got (mostly mosins) still made good shooters so you should have 3 rifles to experiment with.

WWII Austrian 8x56R ammo is great for getting clips if you can find any - it's packaged in 10 rnd boxes w/2 clips. Century Arms had some a couple of months ago but I checked this morning and it's no longer listed.

I've got a starter batch of the LEE .329 bullets cast to try in a pair of M-95's but I need to order the GC's and some brass to load them up.

I just loaded 10 rounds with the LEE .329 GC bullets and 19.5 grains of AA1680 (3.1cc with LEE dipper). They fed through the Steyr wonderfully.
I shot them last Friday @ 50yds. For 5 shots, 3 shots were in 2", spread 6". 5 more shots, 4 shots were in 2", spread 3.5". Primers were still rounded, flattened slightly near crater. Cases had small amount of soot on outside. Recoil was about 35 Rem level so I would estimate pressure at about 30,000 to 35,000 CUP. There was no delayed ignition or other undesirable effects. I did tip them up before loading so the powder was against the primer but then fed them in horizontal and shot. The loading density for these loads was about 30% so I would not buy AA1680 to use in the 8X56R, but it works OK. I will continue to use these as a moderate plinking load. For deer hunting , maybe I will try to increase in 0.5 grain increments until primers are significantly flattened or my shoulder tells me to stop, whichever comes first.
I estimated this load based on an equivalency between weights of AA1680 and IMR4198 which I noticed from other cartridges. The LEE dies include loading data for IMR4198. So I used those values then reduced another 20% just to be sure.

10 Gr Unique works well in mine. The data that came with my Lee dies was the same as 8mm Mauser data. I believe you could use 8 mm Mauser cast bullet data so long as you start low and work up.

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Originally Posted by dbldblu

10 Gr Unique works well in mine. The data that came with my Lee dies was the same as 8mm Mauser data. I believe you could use 8 mm Mauser cast bullet data so long as you start low and work up.

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What kind of pressure and velocity do you think you are getting? What weight bullet and type are you using with what kind of accuracy? Are these low speed plinking loads? How do the primers look? I have some blue dot and AA#5. I might try some loads with these. If blue dot is bulkier it may have better loading density in the 8X56R.

I use the Lee mould with some soft alloy that I have a lot of. The last time I shot it(95/34), the best performing load was 10 gr of Herco. This put 4 rounds into .7 inch at 40 yards with a 5th round flier. This is a very mild load. I would expect Unigue to perform about the same. If you look at the Lyman cast bullet book, they have data for a 214 gr bullet in 8 mm Mauser. I know this is not the same cartridge, but as I say the Lee data that came with my 8x56 dies was identical to 8 mm Mauser data. Therefore, with caution, I use 8 mm Mauser cast data as well. The Lyman book shows a starting load of 13 gr Unique yielding 1385 fps and a max load of 16 gr Unique giving 1580 fps. So, 10 gr of Unique would be quite mild, yes? I will gradually work up, but accuracy will probably go away long before 16 grains with my soft alloy. I don't like to use data for one cartridge in another but I know of no published 8x56 cast data. I do not worry about loading less than the "starting load" as long as I am using a fast powder such as Unique in this cartridge. The worst thing that will happen is you will get a bullet stuck in the barrel if you go too low. Ed Harris wrote about using as little as 5 grains of various pistol powders with cast bullets in rifles. If you Google his name, you can probably find his articles. In Phil Sharpes old reloading book, he listed lots of gallery load data as well.

Mike,
I reloaded for my Steyr carbine the other day with loads using the Lee cast projectile, Lee Alox and a 32 gas check.

The often quoted 17.5gn of 2400 was a dissapointment, with quite a lot of blowback of gas due to the case not sealing the chamber. Accuracy was very poor and I'd not waste my time. I forgot to chrono them.

Using 13gn Red Dot, the results were great. Accuracy at 50yds was about 2"-3" off hand and my chronograph recorded an average of 1297fps. The recoil was very mild and POI was almost spot on with the issue sights. A great load for plinking!

Kirby.

KirbyAUS, try a heavier charge of 2400, if you are going to use it. I had the same experience, with hang-fires and other problems.

CDD

I finally loaded some cast bullets for the 8x56 and I thought I could add the results to mix. May be useful and maybe I could get some feedback also.

All of my M95 carbines have slugged at .332 or more, so I got the Lee 338 220 gr mould. I have been getting some reasonably hard alloy from someone I know (actual hardness is unknown, but pretty hard) so I cast some samples with that lead and ended up with about 30 good ones.

I do not have a sizer in the .338 range yet so I used these tumble-lubed in LLA with no gas checks. I loaded 15 with 9 grains of IMR Trail Boss and 15 more with 10 gr. of T.B. All used CCI 200 primers.

The results were not too shabby considering the low time investment. The pic is a 15 shot group at 50 yards with the 10 gr load which was slightly better than 9 gr. Not sure about the two flyers. Could be me or the equipment, but it was getting dark and I was having trouble with the sight picture. I recovered 3 of the bullets from the backstop and they still had a crisp edge on the base, despite the lack of a gas check.

I did find out today that I had made an error when working out the COL and I seated the bullets way too far in. I have corrected that and perhaps the next batch will not have the flyers, and possibly group a little better. I am still happy with the results. It was a cheap and easy load with very light recoil. Well... cheap except for the Privi brass. :)

My standard load for the m95steyr uses the Lee .338"/220gr boolit sized to .334". Powder is IMR4350/38gr with COW fill to the top of the case and compressed by the boolit. Very accurate at about 1840fps. I am going to buy one of the Oldfeller repro molds from BaBore as soon as I can afford it....

I'm sure glad I read thisthread. My father in law passed away last month and he had a Steyr M95 carbine that I'm supposed to get. I had no idea it was meant for such large bullets.

I won't get it until next summer when some relatives come to visit so I've got plenty of time to round up some of the clips, brass, etc.

MLV

Mike, NEI makes a bee-u-timuss 8X56R design, the 330-245. Drops around .333 for me and weighs in around 255 gr. With 13.0 Red Dot it makes a fantastic plinker,tractor gun load. With more speed it'd do for game. I lucked into mine, but I'm sure Walt cut it. These days NEI is iffy, but it might be worth a shot.

Mike,

The M95s can be a little odd as they "should" have a groove diameter of .329 but they rarely do. That fact, coupled with a very generous neck and throat means that some of these rifles work better with what seems to be an grossly oversize projectile. It's like working with SMLEs. You just never know what the barrel will be unless you actually measure it.

I'd be glad to come out and help test 8x56 loads on those steel plates you've got. Should only take a thousand rounds or so, right? :wink:

Bruce at BRP Custom Molds just cataloged a design cut specifically for the 8x56R chambered M95 Steyrs. He's listed in the Vendor Sponsor section of this forum.

I have several of his molds and can tell you he does fantastic work.

Hope this helps,

Thanks guys for the tips. I'll ask for more details when I have the carbine in hand.

MLV

Once again I have to ask, why did Lee even make the 8x56R mold? I use a lot of Lee stuff, most of it does the job. But I have a bunch of molds that really make me wonder if they've ever fired a shot. I'll check out these other brands for my M95. Do you suppose there's a reason so many of their molds are undersize? I've never got one that went 'over', that's for sure. I'm speaking of their off the shelf molds, not small run customs, which I've found to be good molds.

Bruce is calling it the Oldfeller Frankenstein boolet mold. It should be on the site now, if not, as soon as the update is finished. I haven't cast out of mine yet, but it is a beautiful mold.

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Originally Posted by dualsport

Once again I have to ask, why did Lee even make the 8x56R mold? I use a lot of Lee stuff, most of it does the job. But I have a bunch of molds that really make me wonder if they've ever fired a shot. I'll check out these other brands for my M95. Do you suppose there's a reason so many of their molds are undersize? I've never got one that went 'over', that's for sure. I'm speaking of their off the shelf molds, not small run customs, which I've found to be good molds.

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People were screaming for 8X56R anything a few years back. Lee didn't put much thought into the design. The 338 would they already had works better than the 329 mould.

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Originally Posted by Wayne Smith

Bruce is calling it the Oldfeller Frankenstein boolet mold. It should be on the site now, if not, as soon as the update is finished. I haven't cast out of mine yet, but it is a beautiful mold.

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''

...............The design is up and available to buy. So far as Lee making that .329" design for the M95, I suppose they read that that was the nominal groove and it used a 208gr slug. It's VERY obvious they never checked a few M95's out :-) I have a M95 and a M95/34 and while both have Austrian Steyr actions, the M95/34 conversion was done in Hungary. The M95 has a throat that will pass a slug sized .338" and the nose of the "Frankenstein" will barely touch the lands when chambered. There were the faintest marks at the turn of the ogive. The boolit was seated so that ONLY the GC was in the neck, and the neck was crimped over the GC.

I then took this cartridge and tried to chamber it in the M95/34.

http://www.fototime.com/D3AE80EDB7CEA28/standard.jpg

Pushing the bolt forward normally it stopped about 3/8" from closing so I 'thumped' the bolt handle forward to lock it up. The above photo was the result. The throat of the M95/34 sized the slug down from .338" to .334" and engraved the nose well.

http://www.fototime.com/B28CF43324320EC/standard.jpg

I then sized a slug to .332" (didn't have a .333" push through die) and seated it to, and crimped it into the 2nd lube groove. By saying the second lube groove I counted the lube ring of the GC shank just above the GC as the 1st, so this slug had the GC and one drive band inside the caseneck. I then chambered and withdrew it. The result is above. The lands 'just' touched.

I then chambered it in the M95 and naturally it chambered with ease, but did NOT engrave. The difference in OAL with just the GC in the caseneck, and the GC and a drive band in the caseneck was about a tenth inch (0.100") difference. That's really quite a lot for 2 carbines designed for the same exact ammo!

The M95 has a barrel that is better then that of the M95/34, with the later displaying a bit more evidence of corrosive ammo and probable lack of timely and/or correct cleaning yet it has a tighter throat and shorter leade by a considerable amount. Common to both is a long throat and leade, with the M95 having one just short of unbelieveable :-)

.................Buckshot

That Lee 329 mold that's ostensibly for 8x56R, is a good one for "fat" 8mm's like the French 8x50R and many 8x57 and 8x58RD bores. It sizes down nicely to 0.325" which is a common choice.

I too have sized down the Lee 338 to 0.332" for use in the M95, but ever try to find a 338 gas-check? Of late though, I've mostly used a custom Mountain Mold 0.333" PB.

Even with a "correctly" sized bullet, I've never been able to get an M95 accurate enough to interest me, and I have too many other accurate guns to distract me from further work.

I got my .338" checks from Buffalo Arms. They may still have a few boxes left. If not, you can get .338" GatorChecks anytime on a regular order. Check group buys for info on Gator Checks. He stocks .338" checks, annd you don't have to wait for a group buy...

mikeschuylkill,

using lee's 205 gr 8x56r mold "beagled' to .331" dia. with a wheelweight alloy, 8mm gas checks, liquid alox and 32 gr of imr/h4895, i get 1800 fps from my m-95s. offhand, they shoot "minute of gallon milk jug" at 100 yds. with no leading.

as a long-time caster, i am impressed with bullplate sprue lube from bullshop. it prevents the lead buildup underneath the sprue cutter that can gall the top of aluminum molds speeding up production. it does a great job on steel molds as well. one bottle is probably a lifetime supply when used as directed, but i ordered a few to pass off to friends with spares in case i spill one.

budman

I am getting ready to try the Lee C338-220-1R bullet sized down to .332 for my carbine. Currently I am waiting on a replacement mould. The one I originally got has the corner for the sprue plate screw rounded off which causes the sprue plate to be flipped up.

I may have some extra clips at some point. These are not perfect and have a bit of surface rust in spots. I have used these clips and they work fine, but don't look the best. I got these with the last batch of surplus ammo I could find. The ammo all goes bang, but it was stored in a garage before I got it and the clips show the consequences of that.

I had been using 16gr of 2400 under the Lee C329-205-1R bullet. Low velocity, not the best accuracy and cases ringed/bulged. Will try a 18-20gr charge next test I run. My bullet was seated as far out as I could put it and still allow it fit in the magazine and feed.

My bore is .313 lands x .330 grooves.

If you need a few Manlicher clips let me know.

I made it out to the range again and tested the same load as last time except for seating depth. 10 grains of Trail Boss in Privi brass, CCI 200 primers and an as-cast Lee C338-220-1R lubed with LLA.

I had previously made an error regarding seating depth and I wanted to see if the new length worked any better. I was fiddling with sight settings this time, so sadly I did not get in any 10-15 shot groups as I originally intended but I got two 5-shot groups that were similar and I think it's enough for me to continue to work with this load.

Here's one of the targets from 50 yards. Still not great, but cheap to make and pleasant to shoot.