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Recently aquired a family rifle; Win 94AE in 307 Winchester. One of the originals.
Can’t seem to find much data. Can anyone suggest some data for cast 150gr FP bullets. I’ll powder coat them, same as my 38-55’s.
I’ve read some on ‘lever kick’ above 2500 fps, but I would stay way below that. I reloaded some 170gr Silvertips some years back for this rifle and they were about 2300 and showed no pressure.
Any info would be of great help. TIA.
Not a .307 expert, nor do I play one on TV, but I've got manuals, intuition, and time on my hands today.:mrgreen:
Ranch Dog designed a series of molds for NOE that he optimized for ".30 Caliber Short-Necks":
The TL309-177RF and TL310-178RF differ only in as-cast diameter and are set up to perfectly fit the neck and throat of SAAMI .308's. I run it in a Ruger Scout and love it. Runs great in the low 2,000's and hits hard. Your .307 has basically the same neck spec, but it looks to me like that bullet's nose is too long to work with the .307's shorter max COAL of 2.560".
The TL310-165RF was cooked up for the even shorter-necked .300 Savage and would let you seat to a shorter OAL while still keeping the gas check inside the neck. . .but it still looks to be too long for the .307.
If I'm reading the .307 Win blueprint right, you need a bullet no more than 0.848" in length to place your gas check at the back of the neck and still stay inside that 2.560".
The TL313-153RF is the 7.62x39 version, and as such, would be too fat for your .307, but the Accurate Molds 31-150TG looks to be a near copy, and could be ordered with the diameter reduced accordingly. . .and it WILL fit for length. It's got a pretty aggressive front band and should work well GC's and PC'd. You could even have Tom eliminate the TL grooves and add a crimp groove in the correct spot to optimize for your tube magazine.
Lyman's cast data goes down to 160 grain bullets for the .308 Win. Since you're running a lighter bullet, you should be able to start at or a little above those 1,400-1,700fps starting charges with no concerns. What powders do you plan to run?
Hope that's in some way helpful.
Thanks Bigslug…….I’ve read that most 30-30 bullets ought to be ok. I won’t be using GC’s, but PCing.
As far as powders, I’ve got IMR4198, IMR4895, and AA2460. One of those should be ok.
OK. For the .308 and 160 grain cast and IMR4198, Lyman lists the following
Startling load: 21 grains for 1674 fps at 14,200 PSI
Max load: 31.7 grains for 2378 fps at 37,800 PSI
I have little understanding of the mysteries of powder coating, but I'd want a check on the base at that level of speed, painted bullet or no.
If you have pistol powders and want to dial it down:
Unique, 308Win, 160 grain cast:
Start: 9.8 grains for 1386 fps at 20,700 PSI
Max: 13.0 grains for 1646 fps at 31,800PSI
2400, 308 Win, 160 grain cast:
Start: 15.5 grains for 1501 fps at 14,600 PSI
Max: 19.5 grains for 1805 fps at 23,200 PSI
No powder coat in my world, but I've run good fit and hard alloy and no check to 1700 fps in a .310/.32-20 Cadet when the pressure signs on the primer told me to back off. Accuracy load for that bullet ended up in the middle 1500's as I recall. I attempted a plain base download for a .416 Rigby. Due to the huge volume of the case I didn't want to reduce the charge much below minimum, and it needed checks to even group at all at about 1850 fps. YMMV, but experiences like those lend me to think the gas check demon lives somewhere around 1600 fps.
Thanks again! I’ve run PC boolits up to 1750fps with zero leading/issues. Alloy is 11.2 BHN. Fit is +.001 from slugged bore.
No worries. Kind of interested in seeing where you end up.
Like the .284, the .307 seems like what could have been a great cartridge that Winchester hamstrung right out of the gate by trying to squeeze it into an action too short to allow it to perform as it might. Similarly, I've gnashed my teeth about the same issue in the .308 as well.
That said, it ought to kill any deer or pig that needs killin'.
I do not worry a great deal about the gas check set below the case neck, common to have the gas check below the case neck in the 8x57, 300 Savage and others. Most of the Flat Nose (FN) 30-30 bullets will work just fine, I like the RCBS 30-180-FN but any of the 30 cal flat noses from 150 to 180plus will work. The Lee 30-150-F, Lee 30-170-F, and Lyman 311041 will all work. I use Matt's Bullets .310 180 FN in my rifles, I have a Marlin 336 that was chambered using a .300 Savage reamer, setup to use full-length .308 cases sized down (before the 307 Win). Matt's Bullets also has a .309 160 FN that should work. I usually start my .30 cal reloading with a .310 bullet, moving to .311, the MAYBE .309 depending on results. For elk I would use the 170 Nosler Partition, the Swift 170 A-frame or the Barnes 190 Original, but deer and pigs should drop to Matt's 180 at 2000 fps.
I suppose I could just use 300 Savage data for cast bullets……….it being less max pressure than 307 should be safe.
May not be a lot of help, but my Marlin and Winchester in 356 Win do very well with necked up 308 Win brass. I haven't loaded a 356 Win marked round in a long time. With no load data I would start below the minimum 308 Win load for the bullet weight and let my chronograph and target be the guide.
Tony
Thanks Mostlyleverguns and AnthonyB…..
I’ve got 307 brass on hand. 300 Savage adn 308 Winchester offer good data and provide a good insight for lower end, as well as max load data for comparison.
Speer 14 has 307 data -- my thoughts would also be to use 300 Savage data if you don't have/can't get.
I have bookoos of books/data; Mostly all jacketed bullets. I like to see some cast bullet data and then work up from there. I’ve noticed that my PC loads end up being pretty close, if not exact to some of my jacketed bullet loads…..Thanks for the insight TurnipEaterDown.Quote:
Originally Posted by TurnipEaterDown